Cpnhelp.org - Chlamydia Pneumoniae Treatment

Raven I have not heard any mention by the folks here with Rosaceai regarding the topical Metrogel which I believe is metronidazolei.  You might try and find out more about that and see if might be an option.  I noticed that it was available when looking for something else  this is what I found;

Flagyl Gel (brand) Robaz aka Metrogel

Metronidazole

0.75% gel

Galderma (France)

30 gm tube x 1

38.00

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Louise  CFSi, CPN+/Bb+,Wheldon CAPi 6/07, Cholestyramine 1-2 pks @ HS for Porphyriai & Endotoxinsi PRN, Doxyi 200daily, Roxi 300BID, Tini500BIDx14day pulses,VitD3-10,000IU, Iodoral 25mg, {S.O.D.3/QD[KAL Brand], Pyruvate 3.75G, SAM-e For Energy Support

Raven,

Wow, you play a full day.  Glad to hear things went well at the derm's.  How long did you take to ramp up to 50 or 100mg of Iodoral?  It certainly seems to have helped you.  I follow your progress/protocol closely as I have similar methylation issues.

Thanks!  :)

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Wheldon Protocol for rrmsi since Oct '05.  Added LDN 4.5mg qhs Oct '07.  All supp's.  Positive IGGi's for Lyme Disease,Babesia, & Erlichiosis Sept. 2008.  Currently:  Mepron 750mg bid and Azithromycin 250mg qd for Babesia.

Metrocream has done wonders for my rosaceai (the metrogel formulation was too strong) it has good anti-inflammatory properties, but we all have different skin types and tolerances. I also use red light therapy which works to reduce inflammationi on a superficial level and enhance the biological repair functions. Lasers results for rosaceai are all over the board -- it's a crapshoot. I'd check out the rosacea forums/sites before committing to have a treatment, just so you know about the type and can have a real expectation. Best site for info is: http://rosacea-support.org/

Good luck.

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Corinna | GFAi. Wheldon Protocol: 4–8/08. Can't kill the yeast.

Thanks Louise, I was actually thinking of asking my CAPi doc for some Metroi topical---great suggestion.And Corrina mentioned it also, thanks. KitKat, I am probably playing at about 97-98% of my old self lately. I have always been a hard working do-it-yourself type. And this summer I am doing some good art work. It seems my perceptual skills are sharper. It took me about 5 months to increase the Iodoral (three weeks of nasty detoxing). Be sure to check with your doc about increasing the dose. I am still taking 15mcg of T3 in the am---I haven't had any racing heart or insomnia so I must need the boost the iodine provides. thanks for all the suggestions, ladies! Raven

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Feeling 98% well and going for 100! Still testing + for Cpni since June '08.CAPi since 8-05 for Cpn and Mycoplasma P. for MSi and/or CFSi. Also EBVi and HHV6 NACi, Iodoral, T3, BHRT, Methylcobalamin injections, Nitro patch, LDNi and Methylation supplementsi

Raven,

Did you resort to salt water treatment[1/4 tsp Celtic salt in cup of water] to deal with bromide detox?  If so, did it help?

Did you start out with 50mg/day of Iodoral?  I am only taking 12.5mg daily.  Too afraid of detoxing.

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Wheldon Protocol for rrmsi since Oct '05.  Added LDN 4.5mg qhs Oct '07.  All supp's.  Positive IGGi's for Lyme Disease,Babesia, & Erlichiosis Sept. 2008.  Currently:  Mepron 750mg bid and Azithromycin 250mg qd for Babesia.

Raven and Corinna, Metrocream/gel (concentration may vary and the transport medium in a gel has more of an alcohol base verses a a cream),  I I recently started useing both a progesterone cream and an estradiol gel Rx bioidentical hormones for menopause/sleep depth issues/and bone loss/replacement effects.  So I do have one that is creambased and one that is gelbased and I was asked if the gel base caused me any problems, it has not.

I am personally thinking that metrogel/cream products kills bacterial causes of inflamation on the surface level as opposed to being "anti-inflamatory" such as a topical steroidal compound would work.   Being a topically absorbed formulation of Flagyl (metronidazolei) I just see that it must do the buggers in. 

Interesting positive skin experience I have had this past weekend.   A little background first for the discussion for those who never heard me write about my Doxyi Rash/sunburn of the summer of 2007, last summer I drove south for 2.5 hours with the window closed and air cond. on.  The car has lightly tinted glass and I did not think of any additional "barrier protection" from the sun, my face and hands and left side of my neck suffered.   Blotchy bright red spots on the arms, difuse burnlike areas on the fingers and the back of my hands, over the bridge of my nose and cheeks and on my neck.  These did not clear like a regular sunburn and took weeks to be gone an were tender to touch. I drove around  for the remainder of the summer with cotton gloves and oversized thick cotton man's shirt that had sleeves that could be drawn down over my hands.  I used and added to my collection of sunhats, as well as titanium oxide types of sunblock.  Mostly I just tried to stay out of the sun and inside.  And with the way I felt in general that was not really that hard.

So this year I have been more aware, always with the hat and not much time out in the open.  Not as compulsive about the gloves and long sleeves but always take them with me when I go out in the car.

This weekend I got the yen to workside around the yard a bit outside, not planned, did do the hat but with the humidity I did not do any more protection and minutes turned into an hour or so, enough to get crispy even prior to CAPi.  I have in the past burned easily.    Not so this time, this is a mayor difference from all of my life really, I have fair skin and hair.  I had the wide brim hat, China style that is rather dome like and provides better protection, I had a thick teeshirt with sleeves to the elbows and a rather high neck and I had on shorts but my sport shoes had sox covered my feet.   I got no burn on my legs either,   this is amazing, almost seems related to CAP.  One very small area of very light sunburn on my right elbow, posterior area and it is turning to tan (OK no one else sees it as tan but it is a tan for me and the tenderness was very minimal and is gone now in 2 days, and my arms and hands are "tan".

 

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Louise  CFSi, CPN+/Bb+,Wheldon CAPi 6/07, Cholestyramine 1-2 pks @ HS for Porphyriai & Endotoxinsi PRN, Doxyi 200daily, Roxi 300BID, Tini500BIDx14day pulses,VitD3-10,000IU, Iodoral 25mg, {S.O.D.3/QD[KAL Brand], Pyruvate 3.75G, SAM-e For Energy Support

It is good to hear you are doing so well after nearly three years of treatment.   I am looking into Iodoral for Ella, so was pleased to learn about your experience with it.

Thanks Raven 

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Michèle (UK) GFAi: Wheldon CAPi 1st May 2006. Daily Doxyi, Azi MWF, metroi pulse. Zoo keeper for Ella, RRMSi, At worse EDSSi 9, 3 months later 7 now 5.5 Wheldon CAP 16th March 2006

Well, thanks everyone for the links. Amazing what a little knowledge will do. I now think I have an overgrowth of mites--Demodex mites. I have read several articles about people catching a load of them from their animals.(The cats all sleep on the bed with us) And because we are remodeling, my husband and I are sharing a very small bathroom. The treatment that was talked about by several doctors that interests me is Tea Tree Oil. I have used this on my toes to prevent fungus but now I will be adding it to my shampoo to see if it does the trick. I am still waking up with itching on my scalp. Ivermectin was also mentioned as a treatment but Tea Tree Oil is handy so I will start with that. I also read that several cases of Rosaceai cleared up when the mites are killed. Compromised immunei systems are talked about as one reason for mite overgrowth. Will post if this works for me.

 Michele, glad to hear you have ordered Iodoral for Ella. I swear by it. It has done so many good things for my body--from chasing away the Fibrocystic breast symptoms to giving me lots of energy to going up against the viral and bacterial infectionsi. Has Ella ever had a complete thyroid panel?

Raven

CAPi since 8-05 for Cpni and Mycoplasma P. for MS and/or CFSi Also EBVi and HHV6

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Feeling 98% well and going for 100! Still testing + for Cpni since June '08.CAPi since 8-05 for Cpn and Mycoplasma P. for MSi and/or CFSi. Also EBVi and HHV6 NACi, Iodoral, T3, BHRT, Methylcobalamin injections, Nitro patch, LDNi and Methylation supplementsi

A very interesting discovery you have made Raven. I did a little bit of reading about it this afternoon. I read that Seabuckthorn oil is also effective but I have no experience with it. The Ivermectin sounds very toxic for some folks and among dog breeds especially the Collie. Hope you find the Tea Tree oil works for you as it sounds good & safe. My neighbor's beautiful Icelandic Sheepdog had Demodex mites over a year ago when the stress from vaccination intolerance made her immunei system fail. Therefore I was somewhat familar with it and the treatment. I am wondering now if it isn't what is causing my own scalp sores as it seems to go in cycles. Appreciate the information you share as it helps us all. Let us know how your treatment goes.  MM

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FM dx 2002 (sinusitis-rhinitis, dry eyes, bronchitis, cardiac, shoulder, liver, gallbladder issues) Started NACi: 4/19 (2400 mg daily 7/21) Start list supplementsi + Iodoral 12.5 mg. daily: 6/19  FIRi sauna, 100 mg Minoi 9/4.

Oh, I also forgot to mention this quote I copied for you in my readings.

Explains Frank Flowers, professor of dermatology at the Health Science Center: "There is a tenuous link [among] Demodex, acne rosaceai, and folliculitis. However, no skin disease in humans has been conclusively linked with these mites." Flowers indicates that one of the most effective treatments for these disorders is metronidazolei cream. "The link between mites and hair loss and other skin conditions is not conclusive, but we do know it's a major problem for dogs," Butler adds. "If you have high revels of hormones, you're going to have high levels of mite reproduction because these anthropods obtain their steroids from the host."

So I thought it was interesing that this doctor thinks the metronidazole cream works best.   Take care. MM

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FM dx 2002 (sinusitis-rhinitis, dry eyes, bronchitis, cardiac, shoulder, liver, gallbladder issues) Started NACi: 4/19 (2400 mg daily 7/21) Start list supplementsi + Iodoral 12.5 mg. daily: 6/19  FIRi sauna, 100 mg Minoi 9/4.

Raven, re thyroid panel.   Things don't quite work in the same way over here as they do in the states, unless we visit a doctor on private health insurance and have the insurance pay for the tests we get, usually we don't get to see the results of blood tests.   

Sometimes I am lucky with my doctor who will give me a copy of test results but usually if you want a copy you have to pay for it.   So the short answer is that although Ella has her thyroid levels checked regularly it is only to check that she is taking the right level of thyroxine.   We have however done the home test of applying tincture of iodine to her skin and watched in fade away in less than 24 hours, which appears to be a good indicator of low iodine intake.  

We will give it a go and see how things progress.

I'm pleased you have found the solution to your strange skin eruptions. 

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Michèle (UK) GFAi: Wheldon CAPi 1st May 2006. Daily Doxyi, Azi MWF, metroi pulse. Zoo keeper for Ella, RRMSi, At worse EDSSi 9, 3 months later 7 now 5.5 Wheldon CAP 16th March 2006

Hi Raven,

Sorry to hear of the new diagnosis!     While we all react to things differently, many with rosaceai find that topicals such as tea tree oil aggrevate their rosaceai symptoms rather than make them better.   It appears that skin barrier disruption is one of the more root problems found with rosacea, and anything that disrupts the barrier more is IMHOi liable to make things worse.  Just be careful.

Also, while higher number of mites have been associated with rosacea (everyone has mites), they are not the only pathogen that are associated with it:

[The assessment of bacterial flora and antibiotic-sensitivity of bacteria isolated from conjunctival sac, skin of the eyelids and inflammatory lesions in patients with acne vulgaris and rosacea]

Could barrier disruption make rosacea skin a "playground" for a host of pathogens?   A bonfire of the bacteria?   

Are you flushing a lot?   If so, check your supplementsi too, as they could be making matters worse.   Are you taking niacini?   B vitaminsi have been known to aggrevate acne and most B vitamin made my skin worse.    Some (admittedly probably only a few) of us rosaceans have salicylate sensitivities (probably related to their effects on Cpni IMHO), but salicylates can worsen flushing.   Flushing leads to more leaking inflammatory infiltrate and more barrier disruption, again, IMHO.

Also, don't count out secondary porphyriai related effects on the skin.   Again IMHO (but backed up by a conversation or two with Dr S), an excess of fat soluble porphyrins in the skin and the resultant reaction to sun and even fluorescent lighting only helps aggrevate barrier disruption.   One note, the absorbing agents (charcoal, etc) seemed to make my skin issues worse.   Carbs and glucose on the other hand help.   Not sure if this is the case with all rosaceans, but someone posted a study suggesting this can be the case with some porphyrics (I think it make have been porphyria cutanea tarde, but I can't remember - it's on the site in one of the porphyria blogs)...

Hang in there... 

 

 

 

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Treatment for Rosaceai

• CAPi:  01/06 - 07/07
• High-Dose Vit D3, NACi & FIRi Sauna Only:  07/07 - 11/08
• Intermittent CAP, High-Dose Vit D3:  11/08 - Present

Thanks, Red. Have you tried the Metroi Cream at all? I was considering talking to my doc about it. I used to have such great skin (inherited it from my grandmother). The facial redness seemed to appear this spring but I have noticed redness on my arms since last year.I found an old picture taken in the fall of '02 just months after I first fell ill. You can see redness in the cheeks, nose and chin area.But it seemed to go away after a while. I haven't used charcoal much lately because I didn't feel like I was getting much in the way of porphyric symptoms. However, after doing a month of Pyruvate (6 grms 1 hour before abxi) I did seem to have some suspicious signs of it. Thanks, Louise for the suggestions. Raven

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Feeling 98% well and going for 100! Still testing + for Cpni since June '08.CAPi since 8-05 for Cpn and Mycoplasma P. for MSi and/or CFSi. Also EBVi and HHV6 NACi, Iodoral, T3, BHRT, Methylcobalamin injections, Nitro patch, LDNi and Methylation supplementsi

Hi Raven,

My response had too many links so it was flagged as spam...

See my pm instead... 

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Treatment for Rosaceai

• CAPi:  01/06 - 07/07
• High-Dose Vit D3, NACi & FIRi Sauna Only:  07/07 - 11/08
• Intermittent CAP, High-Dose Vit D3:  11/08 - Present

Hopefully the "spam" will be released.

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Louise  CFSi, CPN+/Bb+,Wheldon CAPi 6/07, Cholestyramine 1-2 pks @ HS for Porphyriai & Endotoxinsi PRN, Doxyi 200daily, Roxi 300BID, Tini500BIDx14day pulses,VitD3-10,000IU, Iodoral 25mg, {S.O.D.3/QD[KAL Brand], Pyruvate 3.75G, SAM-e For Energy Support

Hold you horses with the IODORAL... iodine/iodide is very helpful - I agree - and specially when depressed might help incredibly, and it might increase your energy and help in various ways; but, yes there's a very big but, it comes with potassium and this combination when taken a little more than less, it starts affecting the heart, plus the levels of iodine or iodide that stay in the kidney and then are released might affect the thyroid in a not good way.  When you are hypothyroid increasing the iodide feels good in your energy levels, but taking measures to protect the thyroid are more vital than anything! _It is just my opinion, personal idea; I'm not a Doctor, just read a lot about it and, because of my personal experience last year when I took drops of "liquid iodine" by Biotics Corporation.  Iodine that seems to be good is the one found in "Kelp" the algae; and you can find these tables almost anywhere.

I recommend reading a lot before taking it!!!! Choices... as my friend MnMs says...

Maria 

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God bless you all.

MariaPatri - living in a rollercoaster! (In Orlando, Fl).

Thyroiditis, sinus infection, heart, muscles and joints. 

Maria, I have some excellent guidance from my doctor on just how much Iodoral to take. He is in touch with the doctors who are doing research on iodine and it's effect on various conditions. Iodoral seems to have done nothing but good for my body. It has sharpened my mind, given me energy, taken away any fibrocystic breast problems I had. It fights infection with bacteria and viruses. Iodine from kelp is not potent enough and may be contaminated by pollution. I took it for a while and it did nothing for me.

Here are a list of links to papers written by several doctors using iodine therapy:

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/opt_Research_I.shtml

There are some people who cannot take it but the numbers are rather small.

If you read through some of the research you will see how vital iodine is to many tissues in the body.

 

There is also Dr. Brownstein's site:

I reccommend ordering his books on Salt and also iodine!! Real eye openers!!

http://www.drbrownstein.com/

Raven

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Feeling 98% well and going for 100! Still testing + for Cpni since June '08.CAPi since 8-05 for Cpn and Mycoplasma P. for MSi and/or CFSi. Also EBVi and HHV6 NACi, Iodoral, T3, BHRT, Methylcobalamin injections, Nitro patch, LDNi and Methylation supplementsi