GliSODin

Does anyone know if GliDOSin is promoting Nitric Oxide? I've been reading some papers and while SOD definitely will help scavenge Superoxide and should prevent Peroxynitrite formation it seems also to have an effect on NO.

Apparently it extends the life of NO which then through the feedback mechanism would downregulate it. Which would then tell the feedback mechanism to make more of it.

 When people are saying that it is growing hair or bring back dark hair where there was grey tells me that it is having a potent NO effect. Many hair growth products promote NO.

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

If you are looking to scavenge Peroxynitrite without increasing NO try Witch hazel bark. A study was done to test the effectiveness of Peroxynitritescavengers and WH came out on top.

 

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=13728878

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

hi Bio - Welcome to the board!

My husband is one who has used GliSODin.  At 2 grams per day and over the course of a couple of months, he experienced

loss of gray hairs on chest and in facial hair and on temples (I was shocked and it took me a while to tie it back to SOD)

inappropriate laughter - similar to nitrous oxide given at dentist

Also seem to give him more energy at a time when he was extremely fatigued.

Backed dose down to 1 gram per day and no issues and but mild return of some gray hairs.

Genetic testing has shown my husband is a poor producer of SOD so hence our experiment with GliSODin. 

Thanks for posting the study, I'll have a look!

Daisy - Husband on CAPi 5/07.  Husband died from Acute Myelogenous Leukemia Secondary to the Infusion of Novantrone.  Ie - the treatment with the conventional MSi drugs killed him.

Daisy on her own CAP 11/2012. 

Welcome Bio, I am currently using GlliSODin in the form of S.O.D. 3 (Kal Brand from Beef Liver)

I had been taking it in devided dosing  SOD complex 400 mg tablet, TID

and about a month ago changed to once a day in early AM before food  400mgx3 or 1200 mg.

I am using it for energy enhancement and it does seem to help me.

Thankfully no seemingly untoward effect currently.  Wait I did laugh uncontrolably at our recent birthday bash, while I googled the topic share by a younger member here, Ella.  She is thinking of her next thrill,  Zorbing.  Oops I am again laughing.  Yet controlably.  I am much to cautious to do it.  Lots of videos of it on Youtube.  Good for a laugh!

My very botanicals aware MD cautions me regarding herbals unless I would want to go the herbal anti-infective treatment route.  Unless he specifically suggests hebal products for ingestion I stick to neutraceuticals and bio-identical supports.  He has Rxed me Silymarin liver support. That is the only frank herbal that I have in my mix just now.

I spent years supporting my energy with Chinese Herbal Formulas.  

I have decided to come around to that which I so strongly avoided for years.   Antibiotic treatment.   No regrets, just praises for Wheldon CAPi thus far.  I can remember several "Walking Pneumoniae like" chest colds that went on for 1 - 2 months, I worked and likely shared it around, unknowingly of course. 

Currently I am doing a more moderate dosage because I weigh less than Daisy's man and my hair is light and fashionably streaked with some white strands (people pay money to get this look), it would be OK if those turn back or not.  

My jesting aside, herbal substance can be strong medicinal substances! 

Daisy - I will be interested in any thoughts on your reading.  I am ever curious about more than I could cover in a lifetime. 

Hoping to hear more from you Bio.   Louise

  • CAPi(TiniOnly): 06/07-02/09 for CFSi
  • MethylationProtocolSupplements: Started08/08
  • Intermtnt CAP: 02/09-02/10
  • Full MethylProtocol & LDNi 02/09
  • Off CAP: 02/10, cont LDN & MethlyProtocol support

I am looking at NO and SOD from Marty Pall's work with CFSi which he thinks is Peroxynitrite gone wild. His treatment involves anything that will downgrade NO and Superoxide. B12 is supposed to be a huge NO scavenger. I haven't had luck with NO scavengers. I was hoping the SOD would be what I needed. It has some good immunei enhancing functions like increasing glutathione. I don't need the extra NO though. I will try one cam in the AM and see if that helps.

I've recently been investigating Lyme when I came across this forum.  I remember thing how unlucky the Lyme folks were due to poor diagnosis and treatment options. The CPni folks seem to be in the same boat. In the Lyme world many are having success using an herbal treatment designed by Stephen Buhner. These can use used alone or to augment prescription Antibioticsi. Many of the same ones that people here use.

Buhner's herbs are Andrographis, Japanese Knotweed and Samento (Cat's Claw) good for sporichetes. And the optional addition of Smilax, Stephania, Red Rood and others for support.

I've read lots of good reports for people just using those. I wonder which, any, might be helpful in CPN or if Buhner perhaps might recommend some to kill CPN.

 Smilax might be helpful as it is supposed to be good at mopping up toxins. I've had some success with it. I read in one place that it might increase SOD so I end up here where there is lots of talk about SOD.

 Smile

One thing that saddens me greatly as I have browsed the internet communities in the last 4+ years is the number of people suffering with little or no medical support. Thank god we have each other. At least with our anecdotal reports we can help and learn from each other.

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

Biohazard, I hope you look at the resources available here.  Yes we know that there is a lot of cross effectiveness of the protocolsi explored here for CPni and Bb.   There is information that explains the specifics of the lifecycle of CPn as a chronic persistent intracellulari bacterial infection.  You can literally read good data for hours.

Not familiar with Similax have you used it for toxins yourself? 

Sorry I cannot hold the conversation regarding specifics of gliSODin with you.

Louise

  • CAPi(TiniOnly): 06/07-02/09 for CFSi
  • MethylationProtocolSupplements: Started08/08
  • Intermtnt CAP: 02/09-02/10
  • Full MethylProtocol & LDNi 02/09
  • Off CAP: 02/10, cont LDN & MethlyProtocol support

Louise - I see that Lyme and CPni share a lot of similarities in abxi treatment and pathology. The Lyme group is much more open to experimentation (MMS, Rife, supplementsi). The CPn group seems much more scientific and actually have much more of an organized plan than the Lyme community does. Hopefully in a couple more years of understanding Lyme treatment they will more resemble this group.

 

The GliSODin from what I can tell does some healthy things like reducing Superoxide, downregulating ROSi, increasing glutatione, and potentiate Nitric Oxide (NO) to name a few. NOcan be excitotoxic in some of us who are already upregulated. I am now only taking 1 100mg capsule in the morning.

I'm also trying Witch Hazel Bark to reduce Peroxynitrite.

Today I took 600 mg NACi sustain which is a cool product from Jarrow that is time release NAC

http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails.aspx?c=1&pid=135&at=0

Today I also took 1/8 TSP of Chlorella along with some normal vitamins and such. Chlorella can do wonderful things for me. At times it has liberated me of my affliction and allowed me a glimpse of what my life (brain chemistry) could be. My initial suspicion was that chlorella was removing mercury. Which could be. I also suspect the Chlorella growth Factor might be doing something and the DNA/RNA content which are very high in Chlorella.

 Have you ever tried it? I'm going to stay with 1/8 tsp for a while. I've taken more and gotten great results which then fade. Nothing I've ever taken has kept on working. I've tried over 100 different supplementsi at this point.

The Smilax (Sarsparilla) is supposed to be good for mopping up toxins (as is Chlorella and Bentonite). Smilax also seems to have a was of increasing SOD like the GliSODin.

It stoppedmy brain fog in it's tracks before I stopped taking it. I was taking 4 herbs and destroyed my gut flora so I stopped them and started mega probiotoc which brought me back to more normal.

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

I also have spent a lot of time in the lyme world (even though I don't have lyme). Just because they seem to be 10 times bigger than us, and have multiple approaches, where as we only have one (& variations).

I started off treating my Cpni infection with the Buhner herbs. Many/most of them are anti-chlamydial. I wouldn't use it as the sole protocol though because I found many/all of the herbs would stop working after a while. Andrographis and JK were my favourites. Cat's claw is also anti-chlamydial, although I didn't use it much because of its steroidal effects. 

 

Hunter: Don't think - experiment

Biohazard,

I think this paper may answer your question. Wink

Fc-Receptor-Mediated Intracellular Delivery of Cu/Zn-superoxide Dismutase (SOD1) Protects Against Redox-Induced Apoptosis Through a Nitric Oxide Dependent Mechanism

NACi 2.4g, Zithi 250mg/MWF, minoi 200mg, Tinii 5day/1g/5 pulses, Valcyte
Supplementsi, CFIDSi/FMSi, Hashimoto's, Psoriasis, PA, IBSi, Sec Addisons

Don't believe everything you think!  

Hey bio-hazard,

Bio hazard and All,

 I recently discovered Martin Pall's work on the NO/ONOO, and it's role in creating the peroxynitrite vicious spiral. The ON/ONOO relates to viral infectionsi and bacterial infections, as well as other stressors. The NO/ONOO really seems to fit my situation because of my reactions to caffine, NItro, and L-arginine, and provigil. All of these increase NO in the body and all of them give me very clear symptoms that are the same. I can't tolerate the extra NO before I really get spaced out, cold hands and feet, cognitive decline, etc. Also, when I took some Arginine the other day I felt really right for the first time in years, but it was short lived after the other complications began. SO my body seems to thrive on the NO for a bit before it makes me really sick.

 For those not familiar, here's a link to Pall's website: http://thetenthparadigm.org/

I also tend to believe and agree with Pall that many diseases are probably from similar causes but react differently in different people. FOr example, I can believe that maybe somebody may get gout instead of CFSi, or one person may get MS instead of GOUt or whatever.  I think those are real eamples but can't remember becuase of ALL the reading I did today.   

 

My question is has anybody had any success with (the Martin Pall protocall) scavengering peroxynitrite or "down-regulating" NO to help with disease? Did the witch Hazel Bark work for you Bio-hazard?

 Thanks,

Mark

 

P.S. (peace lee and jeeanroz after our roudy health care debate.)

 

 

 

CPNi off the charts, EBVi, Chronic fatigue 20+ yrs, , tinittus, Orthostatic intolerance, adrenal fatigue, excitotoxicty, porphyriai, anxiety, depression, doxyi, AMOX, and FLAGYLi since JAN 2009,  

Mark,

I have experience very similar to what you describe with Arginine. If I took a small dose 50 mg of Arginine, with a small dose of Orthonine and Lysine. I was attempting to scavenge Ammonia which according to a few articles is supposed to be prevalent in Lyme. The first day I got quite an energy boost, the folowing days not so much and eventually ended up wired. I get very distinct symptoms as you mention when I think NO is going high.

I have gotten a similar improvement with DHEAi, I'm not sure if it's related to NO. A lot of energy then wired/nerves.

Magnesium or anything GABA promoting helps (Valerian, GABA, Theanine, Taurine). I take Klonopin to sleep as I believe NO is going high while I sleep (related to immunei function perhaps?)

I never got around to trying the Witch Hazel. I had an email to the manufacturer asking whether it was from the "bark" or not as the study mentioned they used bark. I read a lot about Witch Hazel being an astringent. So I backed off thinking it might be toxic as it's applied externally on woulds and such. I still have it, maybe I'll give it a try.

As for Ammonia Aspartate, Lysine, Arginine and possibly Ornithine were supposed to help reduce Ammonia but will increase NO. Perhaps you felt better initially due to a drop in Ammonia then the NO kicked in.

I don't believe I have an Ammonia problem. Those who do say they can smell it in their sweat. I might be slighty elevated (you may also) and maybe one a week Arginine might help bring it down.

There are a few supplementsi I don't take every day. If something initally works then doesn't you might consider spacing out th dosing, every third day, 4th, once a week. Etc...

BH

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

Mark,

Here is a good article where CFS expert Paul Cheney discusses Pall's work.

http://www.dfwcfids.org/medical/cheney/heart04.part2b.htm

Doxyi 100mgx2, Azithromycin 250mg MWF, Probiotics: PB8, JarrowDophilus. CFSi since 2003. Last 5+ years lots of the usual research (Depression, Adrenal Fatigue, HPA, Mercury, Candida, Thyroid, etc.). iherb.com $5 coupon code: HAW103

Biohazard,

Good info about the GABA promoting supplementsi and vits. I'll give some a try.

 I tried the Lysine, not for ammonia, but because it is supposed to have an effect on light-headedness if one is deficient in Lysine. I can't tell yet if is helping or not, but it has only been a few days. Maybe it may be helping with Ammonia if it works.

 I opted for rosemary capsules instead of the witch hazel bark for the scavengering of Peroxynitrite. we'll see. I'm going to do some glidosin as well. The Glidosin sounds very promising for this application. I'm hopeful based on Daisy's husband's experience too.

 thank for the link to Cheney's website. I read those articles before, and they are all great.

I also just received Martin Pall's book, so I'm looking forwad to reading that when I can muster up some juice.

 Based on how many people are sick with just strange untreatable diseasesi like autism, or FM, CFSi, MSi. and the work I have read recently; I have a very positive feeling that some day in the next few years this whole CFS puzzle is going to get cracked wide open!

Thanks Mark

 

CPNi off the charts, EBVi, Chronic fatigue 20+ yrs, , tinittus, Orthostatic intolerance, adrenal fatigue, excitotoxicty, porphyriai, anxiety, depression, doxyi, AMOX, and FLAGYLi since JAN 2009,  

biohazard, thank for posting the link -- that's a great CFIDSi support group website (at first I didn't realize it was for the  DFW area) ... someone spends a lot of time reading and compiling the information for that site!  I've bookmarked it.

JeanneRoz

JeanneRoz ~ DXi'd w/ CPNi 4/2007; 6/07 -"officially" dx'd w/CFIDSi/FM; also: HHV6, EBVi, IBSi-C, 100 Doxyi:BIDi; 500 mg Biaxin BIDi; Tindamax Pulses, B12 shots, ERFA Dessicated Thyroid,Cortef, Iodoral 25 mg, Vit D-6,000 uni

Biohazard and all,

I think my wired spacey feeling may be "excitotoxicity". That is the feeling I get from the extra NO.  I feel like I am loosing my mind when excitotoxic.  I think Magnesium is considered a NMDA antagonist, and the Mag seems to help calm me down from the excitotoxicity..

 

Bio...We may be wired the same way based on our responses to NO? You mind sharing  any other favorite supplementsi you have that really seem to help out with symptoms??? I use Alpha LIpoic Acidi and L Carnitine as a favorite. It really works well for me. I have much better mental acuity when taking it. I'm not at the moment, but it is my favorite supplement so far. The B-12 injections are good too. 

I would really like to find something to help with depression. Have you had any luck with supplementsi that help with depression?

 

I tried some "Thymic immunei factors" recently from life extension that helped with depression, but after ahile I got cold hands and feet..

http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/Item00224/Thymic-Immune-Factors.html

I had some good energy from those Thymic immune, but not sure if it was more of the "upregulated NO" situation with the cold hands and feet after a few days. Always tough figuring out these symptoms and side effects. The mental clarity and energy was good from the Thymic while it lasted. I will try it again and let everybody know if they help.

Any good tips would be appreciated for the depressed and excitotoxic.

Thanks! Mark

CPNi off the charts, EBVi, Chronic fatigue 20+ yrs, , tinittus, Orthostatic intolerance, adrenal fatigue, excitotoxicty, porphyriai, anxiety, depression, doxyi, AMOX, and FLAGYLi since JAN 2009,  

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