For some reason, the first thing I saw on the home page of this site is just sinking in. Look at the picture of the parasite-ridden red blood cells on the home page.
No wonder CFSi sometimes shows a low ESR! And the achiness, too, could be due in part to the mechanical difficulty of squeezing those misshapen, oversized RBC's through a capillary.
Low ESR doesn't exist in the U.S. standard medical training -- it's only associated with inflamatory conditions, and generally only considered significant if it's high (over 20.) I understand that in some of the British standard handbooks, an ESR under 5 is considered abnormal. I found, but don't have the links right now, that low ESR is associated with Giant Cell Arteritisi, another C.Pn. related condition.
Does anyone else who is under treatment for CPNi related conditions happen to know what their ESR was before they started treatment?
Ron
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Ron
On CAPi for CFSi starting 01/06 (NE Ohio, USA)
Currently: doxyii & zithii -- continuous; metronidazoleii -- 5 days on, 9 days off.
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The labs usually noted that
The labs usually noted that my blood samples were "extremely turbid." I wonder if that is the same thing.
I noticed how much better I am at sea level as opposed to in the mountains.
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Combined Antibiotic Protocol minocycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei for muscle pain, insomnia, interstitial cystitisi, sinus, disphonia, dry eyes, stiff neck, veins, thyroid, TMJ.
My prose has been noted
My prose has been noted the same. Or was that "extremely turgid?" I have looked at my early blood results, and I have everything under the sun except sed rate! Oh well.
On Wheldon/Stratton protocol for Cpni in CFSi/FMSi since December 2004.
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CAPi for Cpni 11/04. Dx: 25yrs CFSi & FMSi. Currently: 150mg BID Roxithromycin, Doxycycline 100mg BID, Tinii 1000mg/day pulses; Vit D2000 units, T4 & T3
my sed rate has always
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zero negative sjogren's diagnosed 2/03, 200mg minocin daily, biaxin,plaquinel mwf, flagyli every 3 weeks.
At 6 months of treatment my
At 6 months of treatment my sed rate is 4, my doctor was concerned about it being too low and commented we may consider something to decoagnulate, and I am in Washington state. Proabaly heparin, but I'm not sure. I have RAi, my sed rate must have been done before as a highish ones are common in active disease. I'll look and see but it is low now certainly.
marie
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On CAPi since Sept '05 for MSi, RAi, Asthmai, sciatica. EDSSi at start 5.5.(early cane) Now 6 (cane full time) Currently on: Doxyi 200, Azith 3x week, Tinii cont. over summer '07, back to pulses of flagyli winter '08 all supplementsi. "Color out side the lines
 I was amazed to come
I was amazed to come across this information and the more detailed recent studies on hypocoagulation - thanks so much to those who posted this information, I believe it's pertinent to my personal case.
I have been suffering overlapping recurrances of Rheumatic Fever from Strep A (orginally incorrectly diagnosed as HLB27 arthritis / RA) - unsure if CPni has confused / worsened the issue, especially fatigue as I tested positive to antibodies of a previous infection (don't most of us!) 3 years ago, I had already been on doxycycline as an alternative DMARD for 3 years at the time of the tests.
My higgest ESR over the past 6 years was 4! Unbelievable that not a single doctor nor specialist considered this unusual considering all my diagnoses were of an inflammatory nature.
It does make sense of an event recently at the ER when a nurse spent a good 10 mins trying to get the last ml of blood to get to a tiny 11mls from my vien!!
One time a nurse couldn't
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Combined Antibiotic Protocol minocycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei for muscle pain, insomnia, interstitial cystitisi, sinus, disphonia, dry eyes, stiff neck, veins, thyroid, TMJ.
 What about not even being
What about not even being able to get a drop out? Could this be a similar problem or was it completely different? One ER visit I had a nurse have 4 tries at a cannular - still with no luck? The Doc finally got some out using the other arm & different spot.
Has anyone had luck with positive test results for hypocoagulation - which ones seem more specific / sensitive to this issue. I already have heart valve damage so need to be careful about taking meds which affect the pumping of my heart.
Well, between all of us, I
Well, between all of us, I think low ESR is definitely associated with at least the CFSi expression of C.Pn.
I'll be interested to see if mine has changed under the CAPi.
Thanks for responding -- this is a kind of a sideline, but one that shows up sometimes in other literature on CFS.
Ron
On Stratton protocol for CFS starting 01/06 (NE Ohio, USA).
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Ron
On CAPi for CFSi starting 01/06 (NE Ohio, USA)
Currently: doxyi & zithi -- continuous; metronidazolei -- 5 days on, 9 days off.
Get the research results you paid for: support Open Access
My sed rate is 1 or 0 but
My sed rate is 1 or 0 but my coagualtion tests normal (or even too little fibrinogen).
- Kate D
Very interesting Kate D. --
Very interesting Kate D. -- I don't know anything about low SED rate and Lyme. For that matter, I don't know anything about low Sed rate and C.Pn. I'm just suspicious, but I am getting very suspicious, now.
I just did a track on your "handle" -- very, very interesting. High cortisol and low ESR. Hmmm. Well, low ESR is associated with a very short list of conditions, most of which are more easily diagnosed by other means -- sickle cell anemia, giant cell arteritisi, idiopathic cardiomyopathyi, and chronic fatigue syndromei (myalgic encephalomyelitisi) about cover it. Cheney and Peterson noted the CFSi/low ESR connection in the '80s. I am not aware of a connection to borrellia or cortisol, but I haven't looked. Yet.
Now, as far as the high cortisol: you might want to get a copy of Russ's book, "The Potbelly Syndrome" . It has a thorough, concise explanation of chronic high cortisol and the bugs that love it -- and sometimes cause it. David Wheldoni reviewed it for us. There's some discussion of this at http://www.cpnhelp.org/?q=third_pulse_complete as well.You are a quick worker, though, finding this old thread so quickly! Welcome to the site!
Ron
On Stratton protocol for CFS starting 01/06 (NE Ohio, USA).
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Ron
On CAPi for CFSi starting 01/06 (NE Ohio, USA)
Currently: doxyi & zithi -- continuous; metronidazolei -- 5 days on, 9 days off.
Get the research results you paid for: support Open Access
Mine was under 5 before
Mine was under 5 before abxi. I have no idea what it is now.
I had cpni and ReA.
bleu
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Diagnoised 98 with ReA (reactive arthritis), Cpni found in eyes! after2 years of study and some trials with Cipro and Biaxin ReA passed. since then colon complications. Did lamisil and fungizone for one year recently, big improvement. Yet still colon probl
Thanks. I saw a reference
 I just see in my card
I just see in my card on 5.11.2002 - BP 165/100, P 83/min. and FW 8. And I had big inflammationi in my hip. Trochanteric bursitis. So it would be expected more then 20, I think.
Jan, Prague, The Czech Republic
Date Started CAPi's:
12/01/2005
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Jan CR /Prague; On CAPs:12/01/2005; 20 years CFSi,IBSi, fibromyalgiai; about 10 years chronic sinusitis, laryngotracheitis, from 2002 hoarseness; from 2003 - v.s. lumbosacral meningoradiculitis, hypertensioni. August 08 - still improving