ATP and low CD4 counts

first off, thanx again to everyones comments, this site can be soooooooooo informative! 

ok, somebody wrote me a personal e mail and they left pointing out something i now believe is VERY interesting!  he stated to be careful with exercising because CPNi can thrive off ATP and we DONT want to raise this level too much.  so we want to keep ATP levels low?  what increases these levels?  its VERY interesting because i have TRIED MANY things/protocolsi/formulas in my quest to get well and ONE that actually worked was ATP!  my current physician has an injection that you can purchase from him (though pricey) that consist of ATP (illegal to compound in some states), glutethione (for detox) and b-12.  well, i remember my first day there at his office.. i was a mess (brain fog, fatigue, listless)..  well, after my consultation i was given a shot..  i still remember my ride home (3 hour drive from los angeles)..  i felt GREAT!  i continued the shots until i became too indebt and had to make cutbacks.   I TRIED to source them out (after begging a local physician into prescribing), but found out ATP was hard/illegal to compound!   my physician has his own compounding Rx so he doesnt have as much red tape i guess.   oh, i tried a b-12/glutethione shots by themselves for 2 months and it had NO affect on me!  so i KNOW it was the ATP.

anyway, moral of THAT question is ATP gave me some of my biggest improvements~  do you think i am LOW because of the CPN?  does that correlate?  does everyone with the infection need to be weary of increasing ATP?  i realize its the energy substance of EVERY cell and its a bit depressing that it needs to be kept to a minimum..

also, there is ONE prescription i forgot to disclose...  i take adderall.  i have taken it for 3-4 years ONLY when the fatigue gets out of hand..  so my question is does amphetamines LIKE adderall increase ATP?  will this set me back on treatment?  i am in my last year of nursing and i'm NOT sure if i can handle the book work and long clinicals RIGHT NOW without it (adderall)...  anyone have any thoughts on adderall, ATP, and CPN?

one last thing.  has ANYONE tested their CD4 counts?  its an immunei marker..  mine were really LOW and low levels are ONLY seen with HIV patients (which i am not)..  do you THINK its possible that CPN could be causing my LOW CD4 counts?  my local phycisian (not the one that prescribed long term antibioticsi)  seems to THINK herbs can boost my immune system enough to raise the levels..  i am cautiously weary..  so i am just curious if anyone has tested CD4 or ANY OTHER immune lab test for immune function.

though i dont put a LOT of faith in most physicians i believe this sites information is more precise then ANYTHING MOST physicians can tell you..  you guys are book smart (educated in your illness) and street smart (live and learn from 'hands on' experiences of treatment)!!  with my illness (chronic fatigue) ive learned that you have to be your OWN patient advocate and sites like this help us do that! 

 

Healthy living,

KeithCool

Actually you want to keep ATP levels high and not drive your cells to hard as they are fighting the infection that's depleting them of ATP for their survival and replication.  They are ATP dependent as I don't think they have the ability to produce their own.

Mitochondria being pushed to hard can result in permanent damage, even in healthy person, so imagine someone with c.pneumonia harbouring inside their cells or any intra-celluar infection for that matter

take care

Brian

The injetion you are refering to I believe is called AMP.  Not to many physcians are familar with them.  I think they also add a good methyl b-12 in with the injection. I forgot the gentlemens name but he pioneered these injections for people with mitochondrial fatigue

I have tried these injections and while at first it gave me some boost it would then taper by about 4-5 hrs.  My thought is, once again the infection was being fed it's expensive source of ATP rapidly consuming it once again leaving my cells critical. 

In a healthy person relatively infection free (intra-cellular) it would be like recharging a dead battery and over time would see some remarkable gains provided they were consistent with the shots.

A cheaper method might be just regular old D-Ribose and B-vitaminsi

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 I agree with Brian. Don't limit ATP (it's tryptophan that you want to not supplement).  Swanson's has an ATP supplement that boosted me, but the effect wore off after a couple days. Dr. Stratton uses pyruvate, an ATP precursor, to boost ATP, and it helps limit porphyriai by boosting available ATP: porphyrins are produce because of ATP deficit. Remove the deficit and porphrin production stops. Takes 2-3 grams of pyruvate, every hour or two until symptoms lessen. 

CAPi for Cpni 11/04. Dxi: 25yrs CFSi & FMSi. Protocol: 200mg Doxyi, 500mg MWF Azith, Tinii 1000mg/day pulses; Vit D1000 units, Cytotec 100mg, Plaquenil 100mg, Magnascent Iodine 12 drps/day, T4 & T3

 

CAPi for Cpni 11/04. Dxi: 25+yrs CFSi & FMSi. Currently: 250 aithromycin mwf, doxycycline 100mg BIDi, restarted Tinii pulses; Vit D2000 units, T4 & T3, 6mg Iodoral

Doxyi 100mg 2X's/day; Zithro 500mg MWF; Flagyli Pulses; NACi 2400mg; Testosterone 200mg; Armour thyroid 3 grains; Cortef 15mg; life extension vitamin/minerals

 

you are TOTALLY right!  it was AMP (monophosphate)..  yeah, i can remember how long the relief was, but it sure worked!  thanx for the info, i appreciate it..  its NICE to know i dont have to limit the end product that give us ALL energy!  oh, ive tried D ribose it too does help!

Doxyi 100mg q12hr; Biaxin 500mg q12hr; Amoxicillini 500mg q12hr;  Armour 1 grain; T3;  Cortef 15mg; 4000 units Vitamin Di; Ursodiol; prescription enzymes; life extension vitamin/minerals
Dr Richard, pediatrician, husband, says you can take adderall with the abxi we use.

 

Rica PPMSi EDSSi 6.7 at beginning - now 2. Began CAPi Sept, 2004 with Rifampin 150 mg 2xd, Doxyi 100 mg 2xd, added regular pulses Jan 2005. Jan 2006 switched to Doxy, Azith, cont. flagyli total 49 pulses NC USA

3/9 Symptoms returning. Began 5 abxi protocol 5/9 Rifampin 600, Amox 1000, Doxyi 200, MWF Azith 250, flagyli 1000 daily. Began Sept 04 PPMSi EDSSi 6.7 Now good days EDSS 1 Mind, like parachute, work only when open. Charlie Chan  In for the duration.

Hello Keith, Welcome, I am looking forward to your toopics and updates on you healing. I a little late in responding but have enjoyed what Ihave learned by way of this thread.

Louise

CFSi/ME.CPnPositive.BbPositive.

Started6/24/07WheldonCAP.On NACi,Doxyi, Roxi,

2/3/08TiniPulsestarted.  Full pulse no w completed day 8. BeginningToNoticeTheEffectsof this pulse now.   Cholestyramine 2packet atBedtime forPorphoriaandDie-offSymptomsOf Fatigue,Brainfog,MoodDisturbances,BalanceFromApoptosis.

  • CAPi(TiniOnly): 06/07-02/09 for CFSi
  • MethylationProtocolSupplements: Started08/08
  • Intermtnt CAP: 02/09-02/10
  • Full MethylProtocol & LDNi 02/09
  • Off CAP: 02/10, cont LDN & MethlyProtocol support

RE CD4 question, you might like to read this post by Marie Rhodes.   Other people talk of CD4 and it might be worth doing a site search for references.

 

Michèle (UK) GFAi: Wheldon CAPi 1st May 2006. Daily Doxyi, Azi MWF, metroi pulse. Zoo keeper for Ella, RRMSi, At worse EDSSi 9, 3 months later 7 now 5.5 Wheldon CAP 16th March 2006

Michèle (UK) GFAi: Wheldon CAPi 1st May 2006. Daily Doxyi, Azi MWF, metroi pulse.

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